christian quotes, quotes
July 14, 2017 at 12:04
but – on the other hand – isn’t that what Jesus did? You have heard that it was said of old… (i know, i know – now i’m treading on dangerous ground.. ah well – just a thought- right?
July 14, 2017 at 12:16
Maybe dangerous LOL. I suppose that depends on how far a person goes with it, really. My brief thoughts follow.
First, Jesus was God, so if He spoke in reference to scripture of old, I would take it at face value as the proper interpretation. If you are divine, you need no divine revelation.
Second, even in His words, Jesus never cancelled the law, He fulfilled it. He sure rolled it up into easy to understand terms in many cases though…..thinking of Love God and your neighbor here…how much law got rolled up there?
Finally. I do believe that God meant one particular thing with every word He said. There might be more than one present day application, but the actual meaning is what God meant. Of course, we won’t all agree on that, but that’s our fault not His.
Too many play loose and fast with Scripture without applying sound principles of exegesis, and simply force it into the point they want to make. I suppose those are the ones I was really referring to.
How’s that? And thanks, as always for your visits Ben.
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July 14, 2017 at 12:38
I visited a mega church here and the guest pastor read a scripture (in red in my Bible) and then said, “But we know that isn’t true.” I left and never went back.
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July 14, 2017 at 12:47
You know I’m not really for public rebuke if it can be avoided and probably not as a visitor but if that happened by one of us or by somebody visiting us I would have stood right up and let it rip.
July 14, 2017 at 12:51
I would name the church but you would know it and the senior pastor. No joke, it really happened. And I’ve heard a couple of other false statements made from the pastor of that church on T.V. ie: “we are not seeds of Abraham.” Don’t watch him on T.V. any more either. No, it isn’t your “favorite” pastor.
July 14, 2017 at 12:55
Well, my buddy is in Houston LOL. I figure that was over your way.
Wally, this is a critical issue and I’m glad you posted it. Since the days of the early Christian church we’ve had pastors, elders, presbyters, indeed POPES (before and after the advent of Lutheranism) who felt it was their job to read Scripture in LATIN from the only Bible in the church, then tell the congregation what it means. Luther was not about all that. He did not believe the papacy should be the sole interpreter of God’s Holy Word. Rather, he promoted “liberty of conscience.” Luther believed that everyone had a natural and unalienable right to worship and follow God according to the dictates of his or her own conscience and reason. To me, a pastor who keeps ramming “here’s what I think this Scripture means” down the throats of this congregants is not a shepherd. This would be more akin to a “Branch Davidian” approach to religion. So, yes, run far, far away!
July 14, 2017 at 12:48
Thanks Steve. That is actually a side to the thought I had not thought about!
July 14, 2017 at 13:36
This is a good one. Cheers Wally.
July 14, 2017 at 13:55
Thanks and cheers as well!
July 14, 2017 at 14:01
You are one hundred percent correct. Preach what it says, not what you think about it, preacher! J.
July 14, 2017 at 14:03
Sometimes, J, I think you are inside my head, as that is precisely the point I was thinking!
July 14, 2017 at 16:07
The Scriptures are about the Christ, so when we read them we should be looking for Him, not us.
July 14, 2017 at 16:09
Well, that sums up the thought quite well! Thanks you. Like the use of the article there, btw. The Christ.
July 14, 2017 at 22:34
This is also very close to what happens in a lot of small group discussions (many of which are considered alternatives to organized church worship). The leader presents the Scripture, then asks, “What does this mean to you?” Heresy in the making.
July 14, 2017 at 22:37
That’s funny. It was hearing a guy on a podcast i listen to talk about what you just said that spurred the thought
July 15, 2017 at 07:15
First of all, I agree with you. I write that so that you don’t whack me over the head with a frying pan.
As for the statement, “What does this mean to you?” That is a very interesting question that needs to be asked in many instances. Let me give an example.
As you know, John 3:16 has been taken in so many different directions by so many different teachers. Some say, John 3:16 applies only to the chosen while others say it applies to all the world. If I, as a teacher, want to know the direction of thought from my listeners, I might very well ask this question. I personally believe that when God says the world, He means the “world.”
Now, as for saying, “this is what it means to me,” I frequently use this for those verses that we really don’t have all the answers to. For instance, “Where did Cain get his wife?”
As with most things, there are times and places where such questions and responses are legitimate.
July 15, 2017 at 08:00
Well, I won’t whack you, as you make a reasonable point. I bet, though, that when you try to encourage answers to those vague questions, that you seek answers based on sound Biblical interpretation principles, and not just trying to force your predetermined idea to fit around a scripture that has no relationship to it.
July 15, 2017 at 09:35
We are on the same page, but let me better clarify my comment. Yes, there are times when the question of “What does this mean to you?” can be a legitimate option. However, it’s been my experience that far too many small groups do what they do without a view toward solidifying a particular doctrine or biblical interpretation. Most of the time the groups have simply had open discussion in the form of group commentary, the leader being nothing more than a facilitator. This form of Bible study is, in my pastoral opinion, very dangerous. That’s all I was referencing.
July 15, 2017 at 08:42
Absolutely…however, some are still opinion.
One thing I like most about your posts is they define the word apologetics. They make us think about why we believe what we believe.
July 15, 2017 at 08:46
I appreciate that encouragement, Patrick, thank you.
July 15, 2017 at 14:44
Another phrase for that form of “Bible study” is pooled ignorance. J.
July 15, 2017 at 14:45
July 15, 2017 at 03:10
Adios to his listening to his audios
July 15, 2017 at 07:57
Do you listen to a lot of audio stuff? I listen to downloaded MP3?Podcasts on my phone with my work van bluetooth.
July 15, 2017 at 08:43
I’m a you-tuber
July 15, 2017 at 08:48
You Tube is cool, too. One can watch great teachings on it. I broadcast them straight to my TV when I do use it. Podcasts works so good for me because I am in my work vehicle so much, and can rarely get a station I want to listen to.
July 15, 2017 at 09:04
I usually do though the last two months I have not. I suppose I have been more busier with preparing some courses to teach overseas that kind of made me want to mentally rest when I’m not reading and writing.
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