Okay…some serious caveats here, if I may
My title is SERIOUSLY tongue in cheek, a joke, and sarcasm. Okay?
This is NOT a political post. If you want to argue politics, wander onward
I was not a Donald Trump supporter in this past election, nor a Hillary Clinton supporter. I voted. Enough said.
There seems to be some sort of idea germinating around in the head of lots of people that I know, and love, that we are about to turn a corner in this country. That may, in fact, be true. There also seems to be an idea that any minute, this country will go running back to God, that Donald Trump will be the reason why, and will be leading the charge.
Well, what can I say. I disagree. Allow me to cover my reasoning here:
Nations don’t “return to God.” People may return to God. People may get saved. People may be drawn to God. People may be chosen by God. People may accept God’s offer of grace. People may be converted. People may backslide. People may do all of those things, depending on your particular theological leanings. Nations don’t return to God. I hate to pop anybody’s bubble, but God’s relationship with this country is not the same relationship He had with Israel, His chosen nation. God works with PEOPLE now. I certainly pray daily that every single person in this wonderful nation come to know God, but we as a Nation don’t come to God as some homogeneous group.
Donald Trump is not a Godly man. Yep, I said that. Look, he stated outright he needed forgiveness for nothing. That pretty much disqualifies him as a man of God. At least, the Bible I read teaches that. Add the man’s conduct of both his personal and professional lives, and that pretty much nails the coffin shut on Donald Trump’s status as a Godly man. Every preacher in the land praying over him won’t change this.
Like it or not, we can’t legislate a “return to God.” A, it doesn’t work. B, it’s actually not allowed under our very own Constitution.
We have had Godly men in the White House, and did anything really change? Think Ronald Reagan, Jimmy Carter, and George W. Bush. The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly if you will. Every one of them a Godly man by all accounts. If we “returned to God” in those administrations, I missed it somehow.
Pagans will act like pagans, and heathens will act like heathens. Why exactly do we expect anything else? I am not even shocked anymore when believers act more heathen than the heathens.
Donald Trump is NOT going to return this nation to God. Nope. The question is: are we going to sit around rejoicing about this one we say will save our nation, while we continue down the path we have been on for decades? The current administration may very well provide us with something quite useful for the Kingdom of God: Room to work, and an environment in which we CAN work. It’s obvious that the alternative in this election would have ended in a far more hostile, restrictive environment than the one we will have for at least four years. The question is, again: what will we do about it, and with it? What is the solution? What WILL turn this country?(Meaning that really large group of PEOPLE we live among.)
It’s not rocket science; read the instruction manual.
But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come on you, and you will be My witnesses in Jerusalem, in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth
Then He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to the whole creation.
Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
Any Questions?
January 24, 2017 at 18:56
So true Wally. Too often I see Christians looking to politics for the answer when it’s God we should be looking to. Donald Trump is not our Savior (still surprised so many people act like it), Jesus is. And only individual hearts can turn to God – not a whole nation.
Keep up the good writing!
LikeLiked by 3 people
January 24, 2017 at 18:59
Thanks Courtney. I obviously agree with every word you just said. I wish we would spend as much time simply telling people about Jesus as spouting their political opinions.
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 19:10
THANK YOU for this, Wally! This is what’s been going through my mind since Trump was elected last November. 🕊🕇
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 19:14
Thank you for reading and your support
😆
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 19:27
I think the one thing I’m hoping for is that a United States president will actually finally admit that there is a massive global persecution of Christians—and that such is actually also taking place here in these United States—the latest numbers…there is one Christian martyred (aka killed for their faith) every 6 minutes—granted Christians are not being killed here in the US but they are being silenced and neutered in numbers far greater than we have ever witnessed….
LikeLiked by 3 people
January 24, 2017 at 19:33
It’s rough out in the world for sure Julie where people actually die for Faith
I have to be honest a bit though. I think there’s sometime a tendency to cry persecution before its warranted. Few Christians in this county are persecuted….mostly because so many are clandestine believers
LikeLiked by 2 people
January 24, 2017 at 19:50
The persecution I see here in the US is not overt like those who are being crucified or beheaded by such groups as isis or burned alive or systematically raped by Boko haram but rather here it is more insidious, more sublime– the forbidding of prayer before events, the removal of “God” from any school function or public display, Christian businesses facing staggering lawsuits for politely refusing to service same sex couple weddings on grounds of faith, Christian staff and students on US college campuses enduring unprecedented harassment…it is a slow methodical dismantling of the Judaeo/ Christian foundation that this Nation was built upon
LikeLiked by 2 people
January 24, 2017 at 20:05
Oh absolutely I agree with every word there. And for those people it’s just as real as being jailed or even hurt. Even here in blog land it can be very real. Some of what happens here is more than just debate or disagreement but very real and coordinated efforts to make Christians shut up
On the other hand many folks claim….persecution by proxy having never even been disagreed with
LikeLiked by 3 people
January 24, 2017 at 20:06
Truly so my friend
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 21:09
Ha! Reminds me of an old joke, Wally. This friend of mine was going to vote for a candidate I didn’t like very much so I told her, “Hallelujah! That guy’s so awful, even the atheists will start praying. He’ll have the whole country on our knees in no time.”
It”s just a joke, but we people don’t really think these things through, do we? What’s the fastest way to bring everyone to sudden repentance and revival? A catastrophic asteroid attack, alien invasion, total collapse of Western civilization….:)
LikeLiked by 4 people
January 24, 2017 at 21:11
No kidding right. Nothing like an alien invasion to spark a revival!
LikeLiked by 2 people
January 24, 2017 at 21:13
I’m with you Wally!! 👍👍☝☝❤😁
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 21:25
Thanks Andi
Not surprised you would be
😆
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 21:25
Lol!!😅👍
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 21:59
I agree with every word of this. Trump may have given us “room to work”, and I plan to take advantage, but I’m concerned our witness has already suffered from supporting such a brazenly sinful person. We need to separate God from the Republican party; he certainly has more people there, but he is above it. The conflation is getting creepier by the year.
All that said, I will certainly be praying for Trump. If and when God really does get a hold of him, I don’t think there will be any doubt.
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 05:51
Thanks Brandon. You know, I get why many Christians think Trump had to be supported, I really do. In my mind it was the issue of the sanctity of life that drove the bus. Fortunately in Arkansas, there was a candidate on the ballot I could vote for and live with myself. But, I can see why many Christians voted for Donald Trump. The alternative seemed far worse. But, as you said, sometime the support of Christians seemed just a little too over the top. Finally, I agree what you said about separating God from the Republican Party. I know some may be shocked, but not all Republicans are Christian, and there are Christians in the Democratic Party!
LikeLiked by 2 people
January 24, 2017 at 22:06
i was puzzled by your writing in the beginning but after you wrote Mr Trump isn’t Man of GOD, Oh My! everything became crystal clear and I pity on those who think Mr. Trump is going to bring nation back to GOD.
LikeLike
January 25, 2017 at 05:56
LOL, yessir the opening was designed to get attention, not necessarily make sense. Thanks for reading.
LikeLike
January 24, 2017 at 22:07
Spot on here, Wally!
I voted too, but wasn’t ecstatic with the choices. It was like being caught between the devil and the deep blue sea—as the saying goes.
No matter who is in office, I serve the King. No matter who commands the armed forces, I’m going to choose to love my neighbor.
I keep praying and try not to let the distressing strife rob me of my peace. Hope you are doing well my friend! Thanks for the encouragement!
LikeLiked by 3 people
January 25, 2017 at 05:57
Thanks for expanding on the thought Elihu. I hope that’s what people will understand…the we ultimately serve God, and not the politicians who run this country. Thanks for reading and your thought friend.
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 24, 2017 at 22:21
I sat with a group of men on Saturday morning, many of whom were Trump enthusiasts, and they were talking about how wonderful it was that Trump mentioned God in his acceptance speech and quoted the Bible. Hey, and it wasn’t even his favorite verse—an eye for an eye… But it did remind me of when Bill Clinton accepted the nomination for President way back when. He stood there and said, “Eye has not seen, nor ear heard what we will do.” So then Trump stands before us and says I will NEVER let you down. I did in fact vote for Trump, with a clothespin on my nose, and I’m hoping desperately that I will not be sorely sorry. The man considers himself our Messiah, and it makes me a little crazy.
The good news is we can still pray and God is still on the throne.
I mostly agree with your comments about nations, and I agree that each one of us will stand before Christ on that great and terrible day of the Lord, but there are some New Testament references to national judgement, including Jesus, Himself, in Matt. 25, where He judges the sheep and the goats. We take it as an individual judgment, and so it may be, but it begins with Jesus saying,
“But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. “All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats;” – Matthew 25:31-32 NASB
So it may be Nations = all the people in the world, and then he goes down to the individual, but nations are still involved. Even in the book of Revelation – there’s stuff going on with nations. So, though I grew up thinking of it the way you stated it, I have taken a step back from dogma on the issue.
Anyway – enough picking nits – Thank God there is mercy with the Lord. Sorry to ramble on your page.
Blessings,
Ben
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 06:02
Well, first, certainly can understand why many voted from. In Arkansas, I did not have to,as there was an alternative I could live with.
And you feel free to pick nits anytime you want to. I value the input of people who have studied these things far longer than me very much. I may not always get on board with what they say, but it always makes me think and study.
I actually happen to agree that some day so many in our nation may be Godless, that God may judged, and sadly many Christians may suffer the effects of it. As far as the other? I reckon it’s time for some study on the issue.
Thanks Ben.!
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 07:40
In the end we all have to answer for our own lives, and that right there is a big deal.
LikeLike
January 25, 2017 at 07:44
Yessir…that right there is a really big deal!
LikeLike
January 25, 2017 at 04:22
Really well said sir, I would say that it’s the fickle mindedness of us humans that keeps these politicians grabbing the headlines. I believe that to be a good politician or a businessman one must know to lie and convince people to believe in it. Donald Trump is a classic businessman from what I know. And as you said, a person saying that he has done no wrong are never the words of a true believer. Even the saints say that they are sinners and Donald Trump is certainly not a saint.
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 06:03
Thank much for reading and your comments. Yeah, not understanding you have sinned tends to stand in the way of a relationship with Jesus huh?
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 06:23
It’s my pleasure sir!
LikeLike
January 25, 2017 at 06:10
Brother Wally, you nailed it. My sentiments exactly. I know it’s early but I nominate the above post as the best post of 2017. I will continue to pray for President Trump and his cabinet. He’s a “loose cannon” of historic proportions. Every day there’s another gaffe.
LikeLiked by 2 people
January 25, 2017 at 06:15
Thanks Tom. I thought this would sort of solidify some conversations you and I have had.
And to an extent, I am glad he is there, as the alternative was unthinkable, to me.
Brandon, up there in a comment said maybe now we “have room to work.” I thought that was well put. Maybe we do have room to work, but the question remains, will we work?
Thanks Tom for your support as always!
LikeLiked by 2 people
January 25, 2017 at 10:47
After hearing for 240 years from the nation’s pulpits that America is God’s chosen nation, Christians in this country don’t generally welcome an opposing point of view.
Yes, we must pray for our governmental leaders.
“First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a peaceful and quiet life, godly and dignified in every way. This is good, and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. – 1 Timothy 2:1-4
The message of the above passage is we must pray for our government leaders so that the Gospel can go out unhindered in this country, to “have room to work” as you mentioned. Clearly, Obama and Co. were heading down a path that was limiting the room to work. Trump may not attack “religion” in the way Obama did but will his ham-fisted, outrageous style and methods, with some kind of gaffe occurring daily, lead to immense political destabilization? I have the impression that “peaceful,” “quiet,” “godly” and “dignified” will not be characterizations of this administration. Paul and the early church faced Roman persecution so I guess we can deal with with this. Actually, throughout the history of the church it was persecution that fired up the saints to spread the Gospel!
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 10:57
Yup
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 07:31
Good post Wally.
Like another commenter, I also see Christians looking to government to solve all our problems, I have been guilty of this myself.
Truth is, the government can indeed solve some of them, even under Trump. But to say a president can bring a nation to God is pretty ridiculous.
Anyway, good post and good fo9d for thought.
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 07:37
Thanks James. I would agree, this administration is behind some this I am certainly on board with. LOL, that’s true despite the guy who is in charge.
I have heard that sentiment so much lately, sadly mostly in church, that this is going the be the magic bullet for all or our problems. I don’t argue that many of our governmental and even national problems may improve over the next few years, but those guys won’t be doing much for The Kingdom.
Thanks James
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 09:15
Thanks for this, Wally. Great post. Americans often put their hope in ONE man to lead the government and us. When we vote, we’re giving that person the reins. I don’t know where this president is in his journey, but I do know that God still controls government, because He ordained it. We, the people cannot put our hope in our leaders. I believe President Trump is making a strong effort to change things, but in the end it’s the voice of the people and the love of God that will set us back on track.
LikeLiked by 2 people
January 25, 2017 at 09:23
I agree that there are indeed some positives here, but as you stated it’s one person with one voice, combined with many other voices that will ultimately change things!
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 25, 2017 at 09:25
Amen
LikeLike
January 26, 2017 at 03:08
Wally this post is right on. We must not forget the work of the Great Commission is the work of the church.
LikeLike
January 26, 2017 at 06:44
Amen, that’s it. Anything else is extra. Thanks, brother
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 30, 2017 at 15:40
It’s like a breath of fresh air. I cringe so deeply when somebody calls our now president our “savior” (albeit, usually from the mouths of an unbeliever, but still… ahhh CRINGE!!!) I do I respect the position of our president, whoever it may be- but save or nation? Yeah… one president (read: worldly leader), isn’t going to do that. Like you said, that’s God and that’s one person at a time. Thanks for sharing this. These are all great thoughts, points and actions. So, what will we do?
LikeLiked by 1 person
January 30, 2017 at 16:00
Me? I’m gonna go down the street and talk to that guy down there. The equation is pretty simple it seems: Open mouth and preach Jesus.
Thanks for your support and encouragement, Jessica.
LikeLiked by 1 person